Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 22:18:39 -1000 From: salanne@convex.csc.FI (Simo Salanne) Message-Id: <46krsv$3ai@pobox.csc.fi> Organization: STACK Finland Subject: Beauforts (Was: Re: 1-2mph?? In <46jo4r$mmn@newsbf02.news.aol.com> djskites@aol.com (Djskites) writes: [ clip... clip ] >I am considering going to the Beufort scale like the Europeans do. Instead >of saying a range of 3-20 or 2-18, we would say a wind range of 1-4 Bft. >1 = 1-3mph 4 =13-18 5=19-24 and so on. Dodd, please don't go to the Beauforts! Only _some_ Europeans still use them, for a reason a cannot understand. Beaufort scale is nonlinear, it is unmeasurable: it's _defined_ to be based on observations (like the movement of leaves in a tree). It's defined for whole numbers only - 3.4 Beauforts is as absurd as 3.4 childs. The SI-standard dimension for wind velocity is m/s. Meters per second. I think it's much more understandable than e.g. km/h, which people are using when driving a car. But watching a flying kite, which moves 3 m in a second, is comprehensive (sp?). If somebody tells me the kite's speed is 17 km/h, it's out of the dimensions I can feel or see. I'll encourage you to go "metric", but then use m/s - forget Beauforts! Smooth Winds in m/s Simo -- Simo.Salanne@csc.fi STACK Finland & STARRC Chair ==================================================================== http://www.kfs.org/kites/simo/simo.html = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 04:33:52 -1000 From: djskites@aol.com (Djskites) Message-Id: <46lhsg$lo4@newsbf02.news.aol.com> Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Re: Beauforts (Was: Re: 1-2mph?? >I am considering going to the Beufort scale like the Europeans do. Instead >of saying a range of 3-20 or 2-18, we would say a wind range of 1-4 Bft. >1 = 1-3mph 4 =13-18 5=19-24 and so on. Dodd, please don't go to the Beauforts! Only _some_ Europeans still use them, for a reason a cannot understand. Beaufort scale is nonlinear, it is unmeasurable: it's _defined_ to be based on observations (like the movement of leaves in a tree). It's defined for whole numbers only - 3.4 Beauforts is as absurd as 3.4 childs. The SI-standard dimension for wind velocity is m/s. Meters per second. I think it's much more understandable than e.g. km/h, which people are using when driving a car. But watching a flying kite, which moves 3 m in a second, is comprehensive (sp?). If somebody tells me the kite's speed is 17 km/h, it's out of the dimensions I can feel or see. I'll encourage you to go "metric", but then use m/s - forget Beauforts! Smooth Winds in m/s Simo -- OK Simo, advise well taken. I know that it is not a precise measurement, that is why I like it. With all the variables used to determine low wind ranges i.e. , flyer ability, line used, inland vs beach flying, steady vs unsteady, etc.... Using a Bft looks attractive because then it is up to the flyer and those variables to obtain a correct low range on a given kite. The High end is easier to come up with. A kite can handle without much or any damage when the wings tips start to quiver, so if that hahppens at let's say 20mph, i would assign it a top end of 18. I still believe that it is up to the Manufacturer first to come up with the best value and then up to the Retailer to correctly inform the end user of the variables. Dodd Gross North and South America Importer/Wholesaler of HQ & Fizz Sport Kites Master Instructor Flight School World Tour Flight School Instructional Video Series \\\\\\\\\\\\Disclaimer/////////////// Because of my involvement with the above products and services, my views and statements may be seen as biased. I can assure you I am a flier FIRST! Quote of the month "Hay alquien aqui que hable ingles?" = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 10:45:20 -1000 From: salanne@convex.csc.FI (Simo Salanne) Message-Id: <47bal0$8r6@pobox.csc.fi> Organization: STACK Finland Subject: Re: Beauforts (Was: Re: 1-2mph?? In <46lhsg$lo4@newsbf02.news.aol.com> djskites@aol.com (Djskites) writes: >>I am considering going to the Beufort scale like the Europeans do. >Instead >>of saying a range of 3-20 or 2-18, we would say a wind range of 1-4 Bft. >>1 = 1-3mph 4 =13-18 5=19-24 and so on. >Dodd, >please don't go to the Beauforts! Only _some_ Europeans still >use them, for a reason a cannot understand. Beaufort scale is ... clip... clip... > Simo, advise well taken. I know that it is not a precise measurement, >that is why I like it. With all the variables used to determine low wind >ranges i.e. , flyer ability, line used, inland vs beach flying, steady vs >unsteady, etc.... Using a Bft looks attractive because then it is up to >the flyer and those variables to obtain a correct low range on a given >kite. Dodd, let's make a diffrence between two cases: 1. flyer communicates with himself, then it doesn't matter, which scale he has between the ears (even olskala, see P.S., works). 2. flyer communicates with other flyers, then we need a solid common base, which Beaufort scale fails. >The High end is easier to come up with. A kite can handle without >much or any damage when the wings tips start to quiver, so if that >hahppens at let's say 20mph, i would assign it a top end of 18. >I still believe that it is up to the Manufacturer first to come up with >the best value and then up to the Retailer to correctly inform the end >user of the variables. That's like the basic idea of Mr. Beaufort: he described what happens to his battle ship in certain circumstances. We could create a "sport kite's baufort scale" like: 0. can't get up 1. keeps in the air, if there's space enough... etc... 6. lower spreader breakes. etc.. 9. spine breaks (Well, if the lower speader is already broke...) etc... I'll bet nobody would be happy with this scale. Smooth Winds m/s Simo P.S. While surfing on the net, for Beaufort, I found a beer drinking Beaufort scale, it's in Norwegian but after force 4 the language shouldn't matter anymore:-) http://www.pvv.unit.no/~steinl/vitser/olskala.html -- Simo.Salanne@csc.fi STACK Finland & STARRC Chair ==================================================================== http://www.kfs.org/kites/simo/simo.html = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =